OOC Chat V

[Ichiro Daisuke]

So if Nintoku had used center stance round 1.

round 2 he would go first, Stand as a simple actions, initiate grapple and could add center stance bonus to the grapple roll.

I think that's the only was it would work though.

[Matsu Nintoku]

So if Nintoku had used center stance round 1.

round 2 he would go first, Stand as a simple actions, initiate grapple and could add center stance bonus to the grapple roll.

I think that's the only was it would work though.

Indeed and while it might not make sense, I will remit you to a horse trampling a huge Orochi =P

[Shinjo Akil]

So if Nintoku had used center stance round 1.

round 2 he would go first, Stand as a simple actions, initiate grapple and could add center stance bonus to the grapple roll.

I think that's the only was it would work though.

Theoretically, save that initiating a grapple is a complex action.

[Ichiro Daisuke]

So if Nintoku had used center stance round 1.

round 2 he would go first, Stand as a simple actions, initiate grapple and could add center stance bonus to the grapple roll.

I think that's the only was it would work though.

Theoretically, save that initiating a grapple is a complex action.

Well you haven't used your complex yet. But that's used to grapple, and as Butaj said, once you grapple you are in control. No need to roll the strength at that point, and so center is wasted.

Though Butaj technically can't throw Nintoku until it's his turn again. But with the way things have been working out it doesn't matter much.

Small edit... So the +10 to init is what makes it useless for nintoku.

[Shinjo Akil]

Unfortunately true

[Ichiro Daisuke]

Unfortunately true

Wait rereading grapple, Butaj has to roll again on every one of his turns... even if he doesn't lose control to Nintoku.

So there are about half the actual rolls missing >.>

[Matsu Nintoku]

Unfortunately true

Wait rereading grapple, Butaj has to roll again on every one of his turns... even if he doesn't lose control to Nintoku.

So there are about half the actual rolls missing >.>

He has thrown me so the grapple breaks

[Ichiro Daisuke]

Well he throws you on his turn. Not your turn.

And a character must make a roll to control the grapple at the beginning of his turn. I could just be reading these crappy l5r grapple rules wrong though. If you control the grapple on your turn you might not have to roll.

[Asako Yuki]

You only roll to control if you are not already in control. Since Butaj is already in control at the beginning of his turn, he can do as he likes.

The rules for grappling are stupidly complex, yeah.

[Matsu Nintoku]

Well he throws you on his turn. Not your turn.

And a character must make a roll to control the grapple at the beginning of his turn. I could just be reading these crappy l5r grapple rules wrong though. If you control the grapple on your turn you might not have to roll.

Mmmm.. true but for sanity sake lets just let it as it is even if I lose.

[Iuchi Saksaha]

IIRC you test every turn.

Round 1:
A's turn: A makes an attack to initiate grapple, hits TN, grapples B
B's turn: A and B test strength for control. If B wins, he can break/throw/damage. If he loses, nothing happens this turn.

Round 2:
A's turn: A and B test strength for control (if still grappling). If A wins, he can break/throw/damage. If he loses, nothing happens this turn.

And so on. Incidentally why grappling is of limited use if the person you've grappled is a lot stronger than you... except insofar as in a boss fight, your buddies get at least one round to hit them while their TN is low and/or they're busy tossing you across the battlefield.

[Moto Butaj]

Well, it's for funsies. Technically after lost grapple I shouldn't have been thrown immediately, but this is how we've been going through it since the beginning so let's assume bariqu is faster and full of throwing?

EDIT. Or IDK anymore.

[Ichiro Daisuke]

Well actually Butaj, Nintoku's throw of you for loosing that round would be the only one that actually works. If we agree on Saksaha's rules.

As stated though it's for fun and doesn't even really matter.

Which after reading it for a third time, i'm inclined to agree with saksaha.

[Asako Yuki]

*Puts on Mechanics Master glasses*

So let's break this down for everyone's sake and try to make this readable and understandable:

Initiating a grapple is a Complex action, so when you initiate a grapple, you have control but can't do anything with it.

Rolling for control of a grapple is a Free action, and can only be initiated by the person not in control of the grapple. So if you are the second person, you can gain control and immediately do one of the Grapple Actions.

If Butaj initiates a grapple, he has already used a complex action and can't do anything else. If Nintoku wins the Control roll, he gains control of the grapple and still has a complex action (or two simples) with which to do as he pleases. If Nintoku loses, Butaj retains control.

At the top of the round, it is Butaj's turn again, as he has control of the grapple already, he doesn't need to roll to attempt to control the grapple, and may take a complex or two simple actions as he pleases.

EDIT: Saksaha's could work. But I would be against it as a) Way too much rolling. and b) It puts the attacking brawler at a disadvantage as they would have to succeed twice to do anything where as the defender only needs to succeed once.

[Ichiro Daisuke]

The line that confuses me is this one.

"The Character with the Highest result of this roll is considered to be in control of the Grapple until the next character's turn." It sounds to me like no one is considered in control at the start of a round. Butaj or Nintoku.

But then I feel I should also point out that Acting is not a contested roll.

It was tn 15 to see Khulun as Silvia. :p

Since we are discussing rules and all.